Ayo Fagbemi is co-founder of the creative studio Play Nice and Strategist at the agency Mother.
Ayo began his career after signing up to ‘The Kennedys’ - Wieden + Kennedy’s creative incubator programme - in 2017. He soon after landed himself a full time role when W+K’s staff recognised him as a Strategic thinker despite the programme’s focus on the creative side of agency life.
When I asked Ayo what he thought was the defining difference between a Creative and a Strategist, he told me that in the most traditional sense, the Creative was responsible for coming up with - and shaping - the ideas, while the role of the Strategist/Planner was to guide that creative vehicle in the right direction. He went on to say that, ‘the best creatives will probably take an idea from someone in Accounts or Production or Strategy, because the best idea should win.’
I had first connected with Ayo back in 2017 after I wrote an article about the London-based YouTube channel LOUDHOUSE. At the time, Ayo was the Editor of a platform called Diss. and we spoke about more writing opportunities with young people and counterculture at the forefront. After university, he took the rite of passage, went travelling and had a couple attempts at becoming a journalist. Ultimately he found it to be a very insular world and with his lack of industry connections, he opted for a change in career.
While Ayo told me that he doesn’t believe his extracurricular work with Diss. made his journey into ad-land easier, he did say that it was useful in that it gave him something to talk about. A point to springboard off; an interesting part of his personality that he could proudly discuss. We talked about a few more of his successful and not-so-successful endeavours and he came to one poignant conclusion:
“It taught me man, that you need to start something. Whether it’s a t-shirt, a scrap of paper or an article. You gotta show something. I always say it's luck as well, there’s massive amounts of luck.”
Sometime in 2019, Ayo co-founded the creative studio Play Nice which is (in his own words), “a journey. It’s very much about creating intersections between different communities and fostering counter culture between different communities as well.”
Experimental in their approach and output, Play Nice has curated a range of work including a community-led workshop with No Signal Radio and a project called The New Rave for The Design Museum. They’ve also been nominated for a Beazley Design of the Year Award for their UKSCN Climate Strike Placards, and most recently they’ve created an incubator called The Pattern giving young creatives the chance to bring their vision to life. It’s a studio for the team’s ideas but it’s also a space in which they can create stuff that’s outside the hard-nosed commercial realm of their jobs. Play Nice is constantly evolving and it gives the team a chance to separate career-work and personal-work in a way that’s balanced and rewarding.
Since things are sort of returning to normality, can you give me some perspective on what the last year had taught you both professionally and personally?
If I’m honest with you, what 2020 has taught me - and it sounds cliche - but it’s taught me what’s important. Loved ones, family...and also like, not to take work too seriously.
I guess maybe I’m saying that from a privileged position (I am quite aware of that) but what I’m trying to say about it is that there is an opportunity to of course do really well and make really cool work, but there’s also the pressure, not to put too much pressure on myself. Making sure we’re all in that place of understanding of balancing work and life, but also understanding living a normal life helps you be better at work as well.
If you look at all of the best Creatives and Strategists, for me in my opinion they live lives and are interested in things that are going on in the world and have certain points of view and look at the world in interesting ways. It’s important not to get bogged down in Twitter threads of ‘share of voice’ vs ‘Share of Search’.
There’s an element of perseverance but there’s also an element of smiling through whatever situation it is you’re presented with and finding the positives. I guess it sounds super hippy but I think there’s always something to smile about.
A lot of people who want to move into the creative world are feeling anxious and uncertain about their future right now. What could they be doing in this period to get closer to achieving their goals.
It’s a hard industry to get into which makes people ask the question ‘how badly do you want it?’ There is a lot of that, the showcasing of how badly you want it.
The number one thing I would say is to not be embarrassed by stuff, to not be embarrassed to email that person two times, maybe three times - ok, maybe no more than three. But to not be embarrassed about messaging that person on Linkedin, to not be embarrassed about asking for advice, or work what was presumed as a dead end job but is now presumed ‘key work’ while also doing your passion on the side. Also, to not be embarrassed about asking a dumb questions.
Secondly, try and make sure you put your best foot forward and use the resources around you to show you can make something. For example, when people do that whole thing ‘ah when I get that camera I’m gonna be a great photographer’, like no. You can be a great photographer with this phone. In fact, try and be as good on this phone as you can, because then you’ll know how to do anything on any camera.
Use the things around you to get to the next step but try not to stay in a space where you just think about where you ‘could go’. Enjoy where you are now...like how many times have you seen those documentaries where so many people look back from when they’ve made it and said ‘oh man those were the good times’. It’s funny how when they look at the good times...they were probably looking at the people who’d made it. There’s an interesting relationship between wanting to make it and making it...but in that old phase, enjoy it, enjoy that you can make mistakes and f*ck up.
Find a way to make something, this is the easiest time to make something. The Strategy Journal man, what’s that? An email, a few questions and an Instagram page.
It’s interesting what you say about not being embarrassed. I know when I graduated my sister would always tell me to reach out to cool people, but at the time I was like “I don’t want to look like a neek”. I sort of realised now, it’s those people who end up doing the most.
I fully agree. You know Samuel Ross from A Cold Wall*? He created multiple aliases to contact Virgil Abloh...multiple aliases. And now they’re like best friends. What that showed is that he really wanted it, I guess that goes back to my earlier point and this industry and people asking ‘how bad do you want it?’
Yes, want it bad, but remember to balance.
Despite the creative industry appearing as though it’s a bit more leftward and compassionate than an industry like finance or investment banking, do you feel there’s an element of cut throat-ness to it?
Without a doubt, there definitely is that element. At the end of the day man, with banking it’s a numbers game. With creatives it is a numbers game in a different way, but it’s always a subjective game as well. It can be a game of getting people to like you and your ‘personality’, but that cut throat element is in business in general, that’s just capitalism.
What I would say is there is a sense that you have to create your own universe and that is a difficult thing. Really you're trying to make stuff and show people how badly you want to be making stuff.
With lots of people in this industry, it’s like there’s two layers, the first being ‘can you make something from nothing...before I trust you with my money’.
What was the hardest part for you when trying to enter the industry?
The hardest part was dealing with the insecurity…
Mhmm, the imposter syndrome.
Exactly, the imposter syndrome. Dealing with people shaping your identity and you questioning what your identity is within it. If I'm honest with you, there's this notion of what you crave validation from ultimately controls you. Sometimes in this industry you can crave validation from places and you don’t even realise why you want it. That was one of the most difficult things for me...breaking away from thoughts like ‘I need to please this person, that person’ etc. In reality I needed to do the best that I could do, be better myself, concentrate on my own role...and I think that’s something I’m still learning.
Another hard thing in my head was gaining what is deemed as ‘respect’ when in reality that is just a concept. Focus on your own lane, don’t look to the left or the right, avoid comparison.
What has changed from when you were beginning your career path, to people starting theirs now? How can creatives use these difficulties to their advantage?
From an institutional standpoint, no. What I would say has changed is that there are more people like myself, there are more black people, there are more ethnic minorities in some of these buildings and I think there’s a push to try and get more people opportunities which I’m a big proponent of. That’s difficult sometimes because it’s not my job, it’s not my job to think of ways to get people like myself in these buildings. That’s a job for the agencies, it’s something they should do a lot more of.
I’ve started a group called The Black Strat, there’s like 90 of us in a Whatsapp group at the moment and it’s kind of a foster community among black Strategists so we can empower the next generation. One of the things I’ve struggled with in my career is finding mentors, often people wanna mentor someone who looks like them or feel like them and I haven’t really got that where I’ve worked.
For example I remember working on the Women’s World Cup campaign, and one of the lines was ‘if you can’t see, you can’t be it’...at the time I was like ‘mate I can’t see any Black!...Or any black Strategists’.
I guess that was a lot of the inspiration behind starting this group, now I know like 90 other black Strategists and it’s an amazing feeling knowing we’re making it a bit more of a reality. Something that more people can be a part of.
As I grow older I’m trying to find some more strategic mentors. It’s important not to just learn the fun stuff, a lot of people in my community - so the black community - all wanna do the fun stuff. We all wanna be the rapper, no one wants to do the spreadsheets or make the rapper famous. I feel like given my experience that’s a bit of my calling, being that ‘Uncle Ayo’ as I'm affectionately referred to by some.
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